53. Commercialising the uptake of hydrogen
Duration 00:25:44
Spotify
Apple Podcasts
YouTube
Transcript
CORDIScovery podcast- Episode #53 - Commercialising the uptake of hydrogen
This is an AI transcription.
00:00:10:05 - 00:00:16:02
Abigail Acton
This is CORDIScovery.
00:00:16:04 - 00:00:43:19
Abigail Acton
Hello and welcome to this episode of CORDIScovery with me, Abigail Acton. The EU is intending to have all sectors of the economy at net zero greenhouse gas production by 2050, but heavy industry and transport can be challenging to electrify directly. So renewable and low carbon hydrogen and its derivatives are key tools in the box from less than 2% of our consumption in 2022.
00:00:43:21 - 00:01:13:09
Abigail Acton
By 2050, it's estimated that hydrogen will account for around 10% of the EU's energy needs. To get there, we need to create a stronger demand for the fuel boost transport and storage networks and secure the renewable, affordable electricity needed to generate low cost hydrogen. All three projects today, all of which received support from the EU's research and innovation funding schemes, have some solutions.
00:01:13:11 - 00:01:31:06
Abigail Acton
Magali Senaux is keen to see the day when busses passing you by in the streets no longer belch fumes at you, instead leaving nothing but a dribble of water. She's helping to ensure as many European fleets of busses as possible are powered by hydrogen, and is working to bring down barriers to their use. Welcome.
00:01:31:08 - 00:01:33:22
Magali Senaux
Hi, Abigail. Thank you very much for the invitation.
00:01:33:23 - 00:01:51:16
Abigail Acton
Well, it's lovely to have you today. Melanie Lienerth is passionately interested in hydrogen powered flight, which she brings closer at age to fly the company behind a test flight believed to be the first forward flight of a vertical takeoff and landing aircraft powered by liquid hydrogen. Hello, Melanie.
00:01:51:21 - 00:01:53:11
Magali Senaux
Hi, Abigail. Thanks for having me.
00:01:53:12 - 00:02:03:00
Abigail Acton
You're welcome. Benedikt Hasibar is a project coordinator at Green Gas Technologies at RAG Austria AG, Austria's largest energy storage company.
00:02:03:02 - 00:02:07:08
Abigail Acton
Benedikt is working on the development of effective and efficient hydrogen storage. Hi, Benedikt.
00:02:07:11 - 00:02:09:05
Benedikt Hasibar
Hi. Thanks for having me.
00:02:09:07 - 00:02:27:18
Abigail Acton
Magali, I'm going to turn to you first. Hydrogen fuel cell busses offer cleaner public transport, and the JIVE 2 project is helping to encourage the commissioning of fleets around Europe. So how did the JIVE 2 project help to make hydrogen fuel busses a more feasible option for people in charge of commissioning new fleets?
00:02:27:20 - 00:03:03:10
Magali Senaux
Yes. Good question. So JIVE 2 in tandem with its sister project JIVE set out to achieve something quite ambitious, which was to support and move hydrogen busses from just demonstration, vehicles to an everyday reality. Earlier funded initiatives had tested hydrogen busses, but JIVE and JIVE 2 funded by the Clean Hydrogen Partnership were the first to deploy them at such a scale, with, fleets varying from five to more than 50 busses.
00:03:03:12 - 00:03:32:23
Magali Senaux
And the goal was goal was very clear. To accelerate the commercialization and large scale deployment of hydrogen busses and integrate them in the commercial fleets. What I found most interesting with the projects is how they helped shift perceptions. So hydrogen busses are no longer just a futuristic concept. They are out there. They're in the streets of various European cities, and they're carrying passengers on a daily basis.
00:03:32:24 - 00:03:37:18
Abigail Acton
Excellent news. Can you tell us a little bit more about, the cities that are involved and what they did?
00:03:37:20 - 00:03:56:14
Magali Senaux
Yes. Of course. So cities like Barcelona or Cologne are great example of the project's impact, among others, of course. Cologne, for instance, was involved in several European funded projects and now have one of the largest hydrogen bus fleets in Europe.
00:03:56:16 - 00:04:18:23
Magali Senaux
Barcelona joined JIVE 2 after being part of the Initiatives Observer group, and when they joined the project, they committed to ten busses, which then opened the door to further interest. And they now ordered an additional 38, hydrogen busses. Fantastic. And in Cologne, you mentioned one of the largest fleets. How many do its Cologne have?
00:04:19:00 - 00:04:25:05
Magali Senaux
Within a JIVE 2 there at 50 busses. And now they have more than 100 fuel cell busses.
00:04:25:06 - 00:04:34:03
Abigail Acton
Oh. That's fantastic. What were some of the barriers? What did the project come across? That was causing this not to happen. And how did you resolve them?
00:04:34:05 - 00:04:44:11
Magali Senaux
Yes. So of course, naturally, when you deploy a technology whose ecosystem is still maturing, you will encounter challenges.
00:04:44:13 - 00:05:12:00
Magali Senaux
And those can be technical issues with both the side of the busses, but also, of course, the refueling infrastructure that you have to put in place to refuel those busses. There were also questions around prices. The availability of green hydrogen. But of course, all these challenges really led to stakeholders, gaining, learnings and gaining knowledge on how to treat them, to communicate to one another.
00:05:12:05 - 00:05:23:14
Magali Senaux
Thanks to this initiative and sharing this accumulated knowledge and ensuring that areas of improvement are addressed is really crucial for, continued progress.
00:05:23:16 - 00:05:31:00
Abigail Acton
Could you give us an example? For example, if we think about fueling challenges, was there anywhere that came up with a new way of dealing with that?
00:05:31:02 - 00:05:37:06
Magali Senaux
I think there was a lot of, discussions around having systems that are redundant.
00:05:37:08 - 00:05:58:02
Magali Senaux
That means to ensure that in case one piece of your equipment fails, that there's a second part that can take over and continue delivering the hydrogen. That has been, for instance, one of the key learning, which is now being implemented with new projects to ensure that that issue is dealt with.
00:05:58:05 - 00:06:01:12
Abigail Acton
Sure, you don't want suddenly something to go wrong and everyone's left high and dry.
00:06:01:13 - 00:06:02:02
Abigail Acton
00:06:02:03 - 00:06:02:15
Magali Senaux
Exactly.
00:06:02:16 - 00:06:14:11
Abigail Acton
I think I noticed that, not far away from me in the UK, that... Did you mention something about Brighton and Hove putting in place some... What happened there? What did they do? Can you remember?
00:06:14:13 - 00:06:24:13
Magali Senaux
Yes. So Brighton and Hove, have implemented, one of the first liquid hydrogen refueling stations.
00:06:24:15 - 00:06:55:17
Magali Senaux
So the hydrogen is stored onsite in liquid form and then transform into gaseous to get into the busses. And that was quite a big project, and that specific site and Brighton and Hove busses are also part of those largest fleets to date. As within the projects, they have around more than 50 busses, hydrogen busses, that are being in operation in the area.
00:06:55:19 - 00:07:11:09
Abigail Acton
Well, fantastic. A little in the side knowledge. I live in Brighton, so I shall keep an eye out for one of those busses. Excellent. Thank you very much. What do you feel most satisfied about when you look back at the project? What do you feel is a key takeaway?
00:07:11:09 - 00:07:24:04
Magali Senaux
I think what's been amazing of being part of such a large scale project, that's taking in such a diversity of areas, is actually seeing the busses in operation.
00:07:24:06 - 00:07:48:02
Magali Senaux
When I joined the project, at first there were very few busses that were actually operating. Some were still finalizing their bus orders or waiting for the busses to be delivered. And as the project progressed, it was always an immense pleasure when you visit a city, and to see the busses sometimes as soon as you stepped out of the train station, for instance, in Groningen in the Netherlands.
00:07:48:04 - 00:08:14:13
Magali Senaux
And I personally don't come from a technical background, so I learned a lot about hydrogen and its potential for public transport through these very projects. In my opinion, decarbonizing public transport, of course, is essential to building sustainable, societies. And hydrogen busses are an option to do so because they replace diesel busses and the projects such as JIVE
00:08:14:13 - 00:08:38:17
Magali Senaux
and JIVE 2 really enable to give cities hands on experience with this technology. To demonstrate what hydrogen busses can offer and really help the decarbonization journeys of cities for those that decide to go with hydrogen busses as one of the technologies to have in their fleets.
00:08:38:19 - 00:08:41:17
Abigail Acton
Fantastic. Super. Yeah, very well explained. Thank you.
00:08:41:19 - 00:08:58:18
Abigail Acton
I'm sure that the general public is actually quite keen as well, to know that they're on a hydrogen powered bus. That must be quite a thrill as well because it's still relatively new, isn't it? Super. Thank you. If you were to protect yourself, say, five years in the future, do you think that a hydrogen busses would be pretty ubiquitous?
00:08:58:18 - 00:09:02:18
Abigail Acton
Do you think we'd be seeing a lot of them around? Is this going to grow and grow, do you think?
00:09:02:22 - 00:09:22:12
Magali Senaux
I think what's very interesting is that the decarbonization strategy of public transport is very unique from one city to another and needs to be adapted to local requirements and conditions. And in the projects we've seen that hydrogen busses can really respond.
00:09:22:12 - 00:09:46:19
Magali Senaux
And some of the areas where actual battery electric busses are not yet meeting the needs. So it is possible that in certain areas you will see a growth, of course, of hydrogen busses, because that's currently the only solution adapted to the specific situation. So I think there will be a growth, maybe even coaches going from longer distances.
00:09:46:21 - 00:09:53:13
Magali Senaux
That's also very interesting, but we're going to see a very big mix. And of course hydrogen busses will be in that mix.
00:09:53:13 - 00:10:13:20
Abigail Acton
There we go. Not in small part thanks to JIVE 2 project and your work. Well done. You. Excellent. I'm going to turn to Melanie now. Melanie. The HEAVEN project set out to design, develop and integrate a powertrain based on a high power fuel cell and cryogenic technology into an existing 2 to 4 seater aircraft for flight testing.
00:10:14:00 - 00:10:23:02
Abigail Acton
So what is needed, Melanie, to go from test flights to uptake by the commercial aviation sector? It's a huge jump.
00:10:23:04 - 00:10:51:22
Melanie Lienerth
Yes, definitely it is. So I think what is important to know that the technology around fuel cell and liquid hydrogen is a technology that enables medium-haul zero emission flight operations. And with that project we wanted to show that zero emission flight isn't just something theoretical or just a concept on paper, but something that really works in real flight conditions.
00:10:51:24 - 00:11:16:02
Melanie Lienerth
And I think what made this project super exciting is that no one had ever done this before. That's really a world's first. So what I can say to give you a little bit of background is that at H2FLY we already proved hydrogen electric flight was possible back in 2016 already with the very first hydrogen powered flight.
00:11:16:02 - 00:11:46:13
Melanie Lienerth
And also after that we had several successful test campaigns between 2020 and 2022. But what you need to know is that all of those flights use gaseous hydrogen and to achieve meaningful ranges that are, for example, relevant for real life commercial aviation. We knew we had to take a next step, and the next step means switching from using gaseous hydrogen as a fuel to liquid hydrogen.
00:11:46:15 - 00:11:53:04
Abigail Acton
Right. Okay. That's excellent and very well explained. Thank you. What are the challenges, for using liquid hydrogen?
00:11:53:06 - 00:12:09:18
Melanie Lienerth
Yeah, sure. Let me explain that. So maybe the best place to start is to explain the difference between gaseous and liquid hydrogen, because that really explains why fueling is so unique and why we want to do the switch from gaseous to liquid.
00:12:09:19 - 00:12:11:24
Abigail Acton
Please do.
00:12:12:01 - 00:12:36:12
Melanie Lienerth
So when hydrogen is stored as a gas It has a very low energy density by volume, which means you need very large high pressure tanks to store it. But the problem is those tanks take up a lot of space. And in an aircraft context, that would mean we would sacrifice payload, for example, passenger seats.
00:12:36:14 - 00:12:52:19
Melanie Lienerth
So when you cool hydrogen down to -250 and 3 degrees Celsius it becomes liquid and liquid hydrogen is much denser than gaseous hydrogen. So you can store far more energy in the same space.
00:12:52:19 - 00:12:55:08
Abigail Acton
But it's got to be kept very, very, very cold?
00:12:55:10 - 00:13:10:18
Melanie Lienerth
Exactly -250°C. That's super cool. But for aviation, that's a big breakthrough because this is what allows you to think about longer flights and eventually using larger aircraft.
00:13:10:20 - 00:13:13:16
Melanie Lienerth
So that's just like the basic knowledge you need to know.
00:13:13:17 - 00:13:27:07
Abigail Acton
That really helps. That sets the context. That's really, really cool. So there clearly the obvious question is the challenge with regards to the cooling. What was done in order to maintain the hydrogen at the temperature needed to keep it liquid?
00:13:27:09 - 00:13:52:03
Melanie Lienerth
Yeah. So there are several challenges we need to solve, whether it's the tank but also the fueling process itself. So what you need to know is as soon as you start transferring liquid hydrogen, a small amount naturally warms and boils off into gas. And that gas builds pressure in the tank. And we don't want to have that pressure in the tank.
00:13:52:05 - 00:14:06:17
Melanie Lienerth
So we use a so called vent mass. And this vent mass releases this gas safely. And the gas is like high above the aircraft where it can disperse. That's one thing.
00:14:06:20 - 00:14:08:02
Abigail Acton
And the cold thing?
00:14:08:04 - 00:14:24:24
Melanie Lienerth
Yeah. And also the cold thing. So, we need to keep the hydrogen cold while transferring it from the storage trailer all the way into the aircraft tank, and therefore, it's it sounds quite simple, but we just use very, very well insulated piping.
00:14:25:01 - 00:14:45:21
Melanie Lienerth
That's the thing. When transferring it from the storage to the tank. And now in terms of the tank, so the tank on the aircraft itself to keep its liquid and to avoid adding any unnecessary weight, we use a design that's a bit like a thermos bottle. Like, you know, with your hot tea.
00:14:45:23 - 00:15:05:16
Melanie Lienerth
So, we have an inner tank. You have an outer tank. And, between the inner and the outer tank there's a vacuum. And also multilayer insulation in between. And this tank concept enables us to keep the fuel cold without adding any active cooling on top.
00:15:05:19 - 00:15:11:19
Abigail Acton
Okay. You must have taken a lot of iterations to develop the tank and the methodology that actually worked.
00:15:11:19 - 00:15:15:06
Abigail Acton
You must have been thrilled when you saw that it was actually possible.
00:15:15:08 - 00:15:33:13
Melanie Lienerth
Yes, definitely. And also when it comes to iterations and safety you do a lot of testing before integrating such a tank system into an aircraft. So there's a lot of testing in the lab. You prove. Are there any leaks? Is it really cooling the way
00:15:33:15 - 00:15:41:12
Melanie Lienerth
it should cool? So a lot of testing that comes beforehand, before even integrating and flying such a system in an aircraft.
00:15:41:12 - 00:15:47:09
Abigail Acton
So after all that testing, did the project actually manage to fly an aircraft using liquid hydrated?
00:15:47:11 - 00:15:56:16
Melanie Lienerth
Yes. Absolutely. And I think that is really what excites me the most about this project, that it really led to this genuine world's first I mentioned earlier.
00:15:56:16 - 00:16:22:00
Melanie Lienerth
So we were really able to complete multiple flights, world's first flights, with this electric aircraft powered by liquid hydrogen. And I think what I can tell you from my personal experience, I was on site and I'm also like, really not a technical person, but when you see the aircraft taking off, when you see it, it flies smoothly and it lands safely.
00:16:22:02 - 00:16:39:08
Melanie Lienerth
It was an incredibly meaningful moment for the entire team. And I think see the aircraft in the air was the most tangible proof you could ask for that concept we've been developing. And yeah, showing that it really works in those real flight conditions.
00:16:39:13 - 00:16:47:04
Abigail Acton
Fantastic. Thank you so much. You've explained that very, very well. You know, you and Magali are both doing something very similar beyond the notion of hydrogen and transport.
00:16:47:04 - 00:17:08:10
Abigail Acton
Both of you are bringing in a disruptive technology to a context which is very firmly established in previous ways of doing things right, existing technology. So if you think about it, Melanie, overall, what do you think is the one part of the disruptive technology that is going to perhaps be the biggest challenge for commercial aviation to implement?
00:17:08:10 - 00:17:12:10
Abigail Acton
Where do you think they're going to be really scratching their heads?
00:17:12:12 - 00:17:33:16
Melanie Lienerth
I think it's not about the technology. I think a lot of people think about the technology as this big engineering challenge and probably the most, or the biggest challenge when it comes to having commercial applications. I think the bigger challenge will be to have sufficient green hydrogen as a fuel.
00:17:33:18 - 00:17:45:13
Abigail Acton
Well, you know, I'm very glad you said that. That's fantastic, because I'll let you complete your sentence in a second. But Benedikt you're nodding, right? So because I'm going to turn to you in a second about storage. So yeah. Sorry. continue Melanie. Sufficient green hydrogen.
00:17:45:14 - 00:18:00:00
Melanie Lienerth
Yeah. So we need sufficient green hydrogen. So what we really need to continue to do is build out our renewable energy capacity to have enough green hydrogen, which is needed.
00:18:00:00 - 00:18:11:09
Melanie Lienerth
If we can have the best technology, we can prove a hundred of times that it works, but we need the hydrogen fuel, and we also need the infrastructure at the airport.
00:18:11:09 - 00:18:18:20
Abigail Acton
And when we say clean hydrogen, of course we're talking about hydrogen that's derived from clean electricity, I think is what you mean.
00:18:18:22 - 00:18:20:02
Melanie Lienerth
Exactly.
00:18:20:04 - 00:18:44:14
Abigail Acton
Because we've been saying clean and green hydrogen. We need to clarify that. That means that it's drawing on electricity, which is clean and green. Fantastic. Thank you so much, Melanie Benedikt. Yeah. Good time for you know. Talking about the infrastructure that went we so that leads on very neatly to you. The EEUH2STARS project is demonstrating the efficacity of underground hydrogen storage in depleted porous natural gas reservoirs.
00:18:44:14 - 00:18:51:01
Abigail Acton
So Benedict. Why, and I think we've got a good lead in to that, was the work done by the project so important?
00:18:51:03 - 00:19:11:21
Benedikt Hasibar
Well, the nice thing about hydrogen is that the hydrogen is an energy carrier, which you can store in large volumes over a long durations of time, which we will need in a future renewable energy system. And actually, in summer months, already, renewable energy has to be curtailed.
00:19:11:21 - 00:19:52:12
Benedikt Hasibar
So shut off, instead of being stored for times where there's a huge need for energy. And this is where hydrogen can be a very important solution. And the storage of hydrogen, especially. What I'm really happy about is that we in our project EUH2STARS we not only show how important hydrogen storage is for the overall system, but we actually are operating our demonstrator plant, in Upper Austria, which is the world's first underground hydrogen storage in a depleted gas reservoir, which makes it quite unique and special.
00:19:52:14 - 00:20:00:24
Benedikt Hasibar
And yeah, it's very nice for me that we not only show PowerPoint presentations on how great this would work, but we're actually doing it.
00:20:01:02 - 00:20:12:12
Abigail Acton
Yeah. You actually have a proof of concept. There it is. Yeah. And I like all these world-first. Very good. Super. So what are the challenges of storing hydrogen in preexisting gas storage?
00:20:12:14 - 00:20:17:23
Benedikt Hasibar
Well, maybe first I can describe what this looks like.
00:20:17:23 - 00:20:18:18
Abigail Acton
Yeah. Please do.
00:20:18:18 - 00:20:35:01
Benedikt Hasibar
So it's not a tank. It's not a tank buried in the ground or a big cave or something like that. It's sandstone in 1000m depth, where a well is drilled into. So in the first place there was natural gas inside.
00:20:35:05 - 00:21:04:13
Benedikt Hasibar
So we already know that this storage reservoir is gas tight, so that gas doesn't go away. And now that the natural gas is withdrawn, we can use this geological formation to store hydrogen. That's been done for natural gas for quite some years now that you store natural gas in some amounts. And we've tried again in the winter, and we now show that it's also possible and feasible for hydrogen.
00:21:04:16 - 00:21:15:00
Abigail Acton
Okay. That's fantastic. So tell me how this works? I mean, do you pump the hydrogen in and then you pump it out again? Tell me a little bit about the to and fro and the infrastructure for that.
00:21:15:02 - 00:21:23:14
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes. Well, at the first place we need the hydrogen to come from somewhere, maybe imports, maybe electrolyses
00:21:23:16 - 00:21:43:15
Benedikt Hasibar
directly at the plant. And then we compress the hydrogen. So, yes, we pump it down, and to withdraw it, we just open the valve again, quite slowly and withdraw the hydrogen and this way we can shift the energy from times when there's lots of energy to times where we need the energy.
00:21:43:17 - 00:21:57:23
Abigail Acton
Right. So, perhaps we could even think of it as being the equivalent of water. You fill up the well and then you draw it off. Excellent. But there must have been some technical challenges involved. Can you tell us a little bit about some of the problems the project had to overcome, or is overcoming, because you're still ongoing as a project?
00:21:58:00 - 00:22:25:00
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes. Well, we are very confident on the technical side. So we've had much knowhow on this topic, and could deploy it here. What we are actually doing now is developing safety standards so that everyone knows how to do. We are also developing plans for bigger facilities, as this is a demonstrator with a capacity of 1 billion m³ of hydrogen, which is quite large.
00:22:25:00 - 00:22:41:23
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes, but we need larger facilities in the end. And we are developing blueprints for storage sites all across Europe. Which is the nice thing I think about this project is that it's not just for us. It's it's for the overall society.
00:22:41:23 - 00:22:43:15
Abigail Acton
You're spreading the joy.
00:22:43:17 - 00:22:44:21
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes.
00:22:44:23 - 00:22:48:07
Abigail Acton
Excellent. And are other areas showing interest?
00:22:48:07 - 00:22:51:18
Abigail Acton
I mean, do you have sites identified for other regions and places?
00:22:51:20 - 00:23:07:05
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes. So within our project, we're 11 partners from five countries in Europe. And in four of these countries we already have sites where an European hydrogen storage plant could be built.
00:23:07:08 - 00:23:09:20
Abigail Acton
Okay. You've identified locations which could work.
00:23:09:22 - 00:23:16:05
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes. That, and we also are doing the planning for the construction within this project.
00:23:16:08 - 00:23:31:05
Abigail Acton
That's fantastic. Super. Thank you very much. And again, like the other two wonderful guests we've had this morning, it's very practical, so that's excellent. It's not theoretical. You're actually up there making this more feasible as a part of the renewables mix. Excellent.
00:23:31:05 - 00:23:31:16
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes.
00:23:31:18 - 00:23:35:15
Abigail Acton
I was wondering... again I suppose it's a little it's a bit like the question I asked earlier.
00:23:35:16 - 00:23:50:17
Abigail Acton
I'm very curious to get a kind of an idea of what the future looks like. What do you think? When in five years, ten years time, do you think that we will be using hydrogen as part of the overall energy mix? What do you feel? More I mean, obviously more.
00:23:50:19 - 00:23:55:06
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes. Well, I think that's quite clear.
00:23:55:08 - 00:24:18:13
Benedikt Hasibar
Hydrogen is being used right now. And the gray hydrogen, so the not so green we are using that now, will be substituted by green hydrogen. And even more hydrogen will be used in sectors where electrification is not that easy to do. And hydrogen storage as part of the overall hydrogen infrastructure will be an important puzzle piece in the future energy system.
00:24:18:15 - 00:24:35:23
Abigail Acton
Absolutely. Otherwise, we don't have our wonderful new airplanes taking off and our wonderful new busses puttering around in the cities. Okay. Thank you so very much for your time. You've all explained the work that you've been doing very, very well, and it does make it feel much more tangible as a larger composite into the energy mix.
00:24:35:23 - 00:24:37:06
Abigail Acton
Thank you very much.
00:24:37:08 - 00:24:37:20
Benedikt Hasibar
Thank you.
00:24:38:00 - 00:24:38:23
Magali Senaux
Thank you very much.
00:24:39:04 - 00:24:40:01
Melanie Lienerth
Thank you.
00:24:40:03 - 00:24:47:05
Abigail Acton
You're welcome. It is a pleasure having you with me today. Goodbye.
00:24:47:07 - 00:25:10:24
Abigail Acton
If you've enjoyed this podcast, follow us on Spotify and Apple, and check out the homepage on the CORDIS website. Subscribe to make sure that the hottest research and EU funded science isn't passing you by. And if you're enjoying listening, why not spread the word? We've talked about the parasites that krill host, and what they can tell us about the biodiversity of our oceans and how to print a house.
00:25:11:01 - 00:25:32:18
Abigail Acton
In our last 52 episodes. There'll be something there to tweak your curiosity. Perhaps you want to know what other EU funded projects are doing to boost the uptake of hydrogen. The CORDIS website will give you an insight into the results of projects funded by Horizon 2020 and Horizon Europe that are working in this area. So, come and check out the research that's revealing what makes our world tick.
00:25:32:20 - 00:25:40:00
Abigail Acton
We're always happy to hear from you. Drop us a line editorial@cordis.europa.eu. Until next time.
This is an AI transcription.
00:00:10:05 - 00:00:16:02
Abigail Acton
This is CORDIScovery.
00:00:16:04 - 00:00:43:19
Abigail Acton
Hello and welcome to this episode of CORDIScovery with me, Abigail Acton. The EU is intending to have all sectors of the economy at net zero greenhouse gas production by 2050, but heavy industry and transport can be challenging to electrify directly. So renewable and low carbon hydrogen and its derivatives are key tools in the box from less than 2% of our consumption in 2022.
00:00:43:21 - 00:01:13:09
Abigail Acton
By 2050, it's estimated that hydrogen will account for around 10% of the EU's energy needs. To get there, we need to create a stronger demand for the fuel boost transport and storage networks and secure the renewable, affordable electricity needed to generate low cost hydrogen. All three projects today, all of which received support from the EU's research and innovation funding schemes, have some solutions.
00:01:13:11 - 00:01:31:06
Abigail Acton
Magali Senaux is keen to see the day when busses passing you by in the streets no longer belch fumes at you, instead leaving nothing but a dribble of water. She's helping to ensure as many European fleets of busses as possible are powered by hydrogen, and is working to bring down barriers to their use. Welcome.
00:01:31:08 - 00:01:33:22
Magali Senaux
Hi, Abigail. Thank you very much for the invitation.
00:01:33:23 - 00:01:51:16
Abigail Acton
Well, it's lovely to have you today. Melanie Lienerth is passionately interested in hydrogen powered flight, which she brings closer at age to fly the company behind a test flight believed to be the first forward flight of a vertical takeoff and landing aircraft powered by liquid hydrogen. Hello, Melanie.
00:01:51:21 - 00:01:53:11
Magali Senaux
Hi, Abigail. Thanks for having me.
00:01:53:12 - 00:02:03:00
Abigail Acton
You're welcome. Benedikt Hasibar is a project coordinator at Green Gas Technologies at RAG Austria AG, Austria's largest energy storage company.
00:02:03:02 - 00:02:07:08
Abigail Acton
Benedikt is working on the development of effective and efficient hydrogen storage. Hi, Benedikt.
00:02:07:11 - 00:02:09:05
Benedikt Hasibar
Hi. Thanks for having me.
00:02:09:07 - 00:02:27:18
Abigail Acton
Magali, I'm going to turn to you first. Hydrogen fuel cell busses offer cleaner public transport, and the JIVE 2 project is helping to encourage the commissioning of fleets around Europe. So how did the JIVE 2 project help to make hydrogen fuel busses a more feasible option for people in charge of commissioning new fleets?
00:02:27:20 - 00:03:03:10
Magali Senaux
Yes. Good question. So JIVE 2 in tandem with its sister project JIVE set out to achieve something quite ambitious, which was to support and move hydrogen busses from just demonstration, vehicles to an everyday reality. Earlier funded initiatives had tested hydrogen busses, but JIVE and JIVE 2 funded by the Clean Hydrogen Partnership were the first to deploy them at such a scale, with, fleets varying from five to more than 50 busses.
00:03:03:12 - 00:03:32:23
Magali Senaux
And the goal was goal was very clear. To accelerate the commercialization and large scale deployment of hydrogen busses and integrate them in the commercial fleets. What I found most interesting with the projects is how they helped shift perceptions. So hydrogen busses are no longer just a futuristic concept. They are out there. They're in the streets of various European cities, and they're carrying passengers on a daily basis.
00:03:32:24 - 00:03:37:18
Abigail Acton
Excellent news. Can you tell us a little bit more about, the cities that are involved and what they did?
00:03:37:20 - 00:03:56:14
Magali Senaux
Yes. Of course. So cities like Barcelona or Cologne are great example of the project's impact, among others, of course. Cologne, for instance, was involved in several European funded projects and now have one of the largest hydrogen bus fleets in Europe.
00:03:56:16 - 00:04:18:23
Magali Senaux
Barcelona joined JIVE 2 after being part of the Initiatives Observer group, and when they joined the project, they committed to ten busses, which then opened the door to further interest. And they now ordered an additional 38, hydrogen busses. Fantastic. And in Cologne, you mentioned one of the largest fleets. How many do its Cologne have?
00:04:19:00 - 00:04:25:05
Magali Senaux
Within a JIVE 2 there at 50 busses. And now they have more than 100 fuel cell busses.
00:04:25:06 - 00:04:34:03
Abigail Acton
Oh. That's fantastic. What were some of the barriers? What did the project come across? That was causing this not to happen. And how did you resolve them?
00:04:34:05 - 00:04:44:11
Magali Senaux
Yes. So of course, naturally, when you deploy a technology whose ecosystem is still maturing, you will encounter challenges.
00:04:44:13 - 00:05:12:00
Magali Senaux
And those can be technical issues with both the side of the busses, but also, of course, the refueling infrastructure that you have to put in place to refuel those busses. There were also questions around prices. The availability of green hydrogen. But of course, all these challenges really led to stakeholders, gaining, learnings and gaining knowledge on how to treat them, to communicate to one another.
00:05:12:05 - 00:05:23:14
Magali Senaux
Thanks to this initiative and sharing this accumulated knowledge and ensuring that areas of improvement are addressed is really crucial for, continued progress.
00:05:23:16 - 00:05:31:00
Abigail Acton
Could you give us an example? For example, if we think about fueling challenges, was there anywhere that came up with a new way of dealing with that?
00:05:31:02 - 00:05:37:06
Magali Senaux
I think there was a lot of, discussions around having systems that are redundant.
00:05:37:08 - 00:05:58:02
Magali Senaux
That means to ensure that in case one piece of your equipment fails, that there's a second part that can take over and continue delivering the hydrogen. That has been, for instance, one of the key learning, which is now being implemented with new projects to ensure that that issue is dealt with.
00:05:58:05 - 00:06:01:12
Abigail Acton
Sure, you don't want suddenly something to go wrong and everyone's left high and dry.
00:06:01:13 - 00:06:02:02
Abigail Acton
00:06:02:03 - 00:06:02:15
Magali Senaux
Exactly.
00:06:02:16 - 00:06:14:11
Abigail Acton
I think I noticed that, not far away from me in the UK, that... Did you mention something about Brighton and Hove putting in place some... What happened there? What did they do? Can you remember?
00:06:14:13 - 00:06:24:13
Magali Senaux
Yes. So Brighton and Hove, have implemented, one of the first liquid hydrogen refueling stations.
00:06:24:15 - 00:06:55:17
Magali Senaux
So the hydrogen is stored onsite in liquid form and then transform into gaseous to get into the busses. And that was quite a big project, and that specific site and Brighton and Hove busses are also part of those largest fleets to date. As within the projects, they have around more than 50 busses, hydrogen busses, that are being in operation in the area.
00:06:55:19 - 00:07:11:09
Abigail Acton
Well, fantastic. A little in the side knowledge. I live in Brighton, so I shall keep an eye out for one of those busses. Excellent. Thank you very much. What do you feel most satisfied about when you look back at the project? What do you feel is a key takeaway?
00:07:11:09 - 00:07:24:04
Magali Senaux
I think what's been amazing of being part of such a large scale project, that's taking in such a diversity of areas, is actually seeing the busses in operation.
00:07:24:06 - 00:07:48:02
Magali Senaux
When I joined the project, at first there were very few busses that were actually operating. Some were still finalizing their bus orders or waiting for the busses to be delivered. And as the project progressed, it was always an immense pleasure when you visit a city, and to see the busses sometimes as soon as you stepped out of the train station, for instance, in Groningen in the Netherlands.
00:07:48:04 - 00:08:14:13
Magali Senaux
And I personally don't come from a technical background, so I learned a lot about hydrogen and its potential for public transport through these very projects. In my opinion, decarbonizing public transport, of course, is essential to building sustainable, societies. And hydrogen busses are an option to do so because they replace diesel busses and the projects such as JIVE
00:08:14:13 - 00:08:38:17
Magali Senaux
and JIVE 2 really enable to give cities hands on experience with this technology. To demonstrate what hydrogen busses can offer and really help the decarbonization journeys of cities for those that decide to go with hydrogen busses as one of the technologies to have in their fleets.
00:08:38:19 - 00:08:41:17
Abigail Acton
Fantastic. Super. Yeah, very well explained. Thank you.
00:08:41:19 - 00:08:58:18
Abigail Acton
I'm sure that the general public is actually quite keen as well, to know that they're on a hydrogen powered bus. That must be quite a thrill as well because it's still relatively new, isn't it? Super. Thank you. If you were to protect yourself, say, five years in the future, do you think that a hydrogen busses would be pretty ubiquitous?
00:08:58:18 - 00:09:02:18
Abigail Acton
Do you think we'd be seeing a lot of them around? Is this going to grow and grow, do you think?
00:09:02:22 - 00:09:22:12
Magali Senaux
I think what's very interesting is that the decarbonization strategy of public transport is very unique from one city to another and needs to be adapted to local requirements and conditions. And in the projects we've seen that hydrogen busses can really respond.
00:09:22:12 - 00:09:46:19
Magali Senaux
And some of the areas where actual battery electric busses are not yet meeting the needs. So it is possible that in certain areas you will see a growth, of course, of hydrogen busses, because that's currently the only solution adapted to the specific situation. So I think there will be a growth, maybe even coaches going from longer distances.
00:09:46:21 - 00:09:53:13
Magali Senaux
That's also very interesting, but we're going to see a very big mix. And of course hydrogen busses will be in that mix.
00:09:53:13 - 00:10:13:20
Abigail Acton
There we go. Not in small part thanks to JIVE 2 project and your work. Well done. You. Excellent. I'm going to turn to Melanie now. Melanie. The HEAVEN project set out to design, develop and integrate a powertrain based on a high power fuel cell and cryogenic technology into an existing 2 to 4 seater aircraft for flight testing.
00:10:14:00 - 00:10:23:02
Abigail Acton
So what is needed, Melanie, to go from test flights to uptake by the commercial aviation sector? It's a huge jump.
00:10:23:04 - 00:10:51:22
Melanie Lienerth
Yes, definitely it is. So I think what is important to know that the technology around fuel cell and liquid hydrogen is a technology that enables medium-haul zero emission flight operations. And with that project we wanted to show that zero emission flight isn't just something theoretical or just a concept on paper, but something that really works in real flight conditions.
00:10:51:24 - 00:11:16:02
Melanie Lienerth
And I think what made this project super exciting is that no one had ever done this before. That's really a world's first. So what I can say to give you a little bit of background is that at H2FLY we already proved hydrogen electric flight was possible back in 2016 already with the very first hydrogen powered flight.
00:11:16:02 - 00:11:46:13
Melanie Lienerth
And also after that we had several successful test campaigns between 2020 and 2022. But what you need to know is that all of those flights use gaseous hydrogen and to achieve meaningful ranges that are, for example, relevant for real life commercial aviation. We knew we had to take a next step, and the next step means switching from using gaseous hydrogen as a fuel to liquid hydrogen.
00:11:46:15 - 00:11:53:04
Abigail Acton
Right. Okay. That's excellent and very well explained. Thank you. What are the challenges, for using liquid hydrogen?
00:11:53:06 - 00:12:09:18
Melanie Lienerth
Yeah, sure. Let me explain that. So maybe the best place to start is to explain the difference between gaseous and liquid hydrogen, because that really explains why fueling is so unique and why we want to do the switch from gaseous to liquid.
00:12:09:19 - 00:12:11:24
Abigail Acton
Please do.
00:12:12:01 - 00:12:36:12
Melanie Lienerth
So when hydrogen is stored as a gas It has a very low energy density by volume, which means you need very large high pressure tanks to store it. But the problem is those tanks take up a lot of space. And in an aircraft context, that would mean we would sacrifice payload, for example, passenger seats.
00:12:36:14 - 00:12:52:19
Melanie Lienerth
So when you cool hydrogen down to -250 and 3 degrees Celsius it becomes liquid and liquid hydrogen is much denser than gaseous hydrogen. So you can store far more energy in the same space.
00:12:52:19 - 00:12:55:08
Abigail Acton
But it's got to be kept very, very, very cold?
00:12:55:10 - 00:13:10:18
Melanie Lienerth
Exactly -250°C. That's super cool. But for aviation, that's a big breakthrough because this is what allows you to think about longer flights and eventually using larger aircraft.
00:13:10:20 - 00:13:13:16
Melanie Lienerth
So that's just like the basic knowledge you need to know.
00:13:13:17 - 00:13:27:07
Abigail Acton
That really helps. That sets the context. That's really, really cool. So there clearly the obvious question is the challenge with regards to the cooling. What was done in order to maintain the hydrogen at the temperature needed to keep it liquid?
00:13:27:09 - 00:13:52:03
Melanie Lienerth
Yeah. So there are several challenges we need to solve, whether it's the tank but also the fueling process itself. So what you need to know is as soon as you start transferring liquid hydrogen, a small amount naturally warms and boils off into gas. And that gas builds pressure in the tank. And we don't want to have that pressure in the tank.
00:13:52:05 - 00:14:06:17
Melanie Lienerth
So we use a so called vent mass. And this vent mass releases this gas safely. And the gas is like high above the aircraft where it can disperse. That's one thing.
00:14:06:20 - 00:14:08:02
Abigail Acton
And the cold thing?
00:14:08:04 - 00:14:24:24
Melanie Lienerth
Yeah. And also the cold thing. So, we need to keep the hydrogen cold while transferring it from the storage trailer all the way into the aircraft tank, and therefore, it's it sounds quite simple, but we just use very, very well insulated piping.
00:14:25:01 - 00:14:45:21
Melanie Lienerth
That's the thing. When transferring it from the storage to the tank. And now in terms of the tank, so the tank on the aircraft itself to keep its liquid and to avoid adding any unnecessary weight, we use a design that's a bit like a thermos bottle. Like, you know, with your hot tea.
00:14:45:23 - 00:15:05:16
Melanie Lienerth
So, we have an inner tank. You have an outer tank. And, between the inner and the outer tank there's a vacuum. And also multilayer insulation in between. And this tank concept enables us to keep the fuel cold without adding any active cooling on top.
00:15:05:19 - 00:15:11:19
Abigail Acton
Okay. You must have taken a lot of iterations to develop the tank and the methodology that actually worked.
00:15:11:19 - 00:15:15:06
Abigail Acton
You must have been thrilled when you saw that it was actually possible.
00:15:15:08 - 00:15:33:13
Melanie Lienerth
Yes, definitely. And also when it comes to iterations and safety you do a lot of testing before integrating such a tank system into an aircraft. So there's a lot of testing in the lab. You prove. Are there any leaks? Is it really cooling the way
00:15:33:15 - 00:15:41:12
Melanie Lienerth
it should cool? So a lot of testing that comes beforehand, before even integrating and flying such a system in an aircraft.
00:15:41:12 - 00:15:47:09
Abigail Acton
So after all that testing, did the project actually manage to fly an aircraft using liquid hydrated?
00:15:47:11 - 00:15:56:16
Melanie Lienerth
Yes. Absolutely. And I think that is really what excites me the most about this project, that it really led to this genuine world's first I mentioned earlier.
00:15:56:16 - 00:16:22:00
Melanie Lienerth
So we were really able to complete multiple flights, world's first flights, with this electric aircraft powered by liquid hydrogen. And I think what I can tell you from my personal experience, I was on site and I'm also like, really not a technical person, but when you see the aircraft taking off, when you see it, it flies smoothly and it lands safely.
00:16:22:02 - 00:16:39:08
Melanie Lienerth
It was an incredibly meaningful moment for the entire team. And I think see the aircraft in the air was the most tangible proof you could ask for that concept we've been developing. And yeah, showing that it really works in those real flight conditions.
00:16:39:13 - 00:16:47:04
Abigail Acton
Fantastic. Thank you so much. You've explained that very, very well. You know, you and Magali are both doing something very similar beyond the notion of hydrogen and transport.
00:16:47:04 - 00:17:08:10
Abigail Acton
Both of you are bringing in a disruptive technology to a context which is very firmly established in previous ways of doing things right, existing technology. So if you think about it, Melanie, overall, what do you think is the one part of the disruptive technology that is going to perhaps be the biggest challenge for commercial aviation to implement?
00:17:08:10 - 00:17:12:10
Abigail Acton
Where do you think they're going to be really scratching their heads?
00:17:12:12 - 00:17:33:16
Melanie Lienerth
I think it's not about the technology. I think a lot of people think about the technology as this big engineering challenge and probably the most, or the biggest challenge when it comes to having commercial applications. I think the bigger challenge will be to have sufficient green hydrogen as a fuel.
00:17:33:18 - 00:17:45:13
Abigail Acton
Well, you know, I'm very glad you said that. That's fantastic, because I'll let you complete your sentence in a second. But Benedikt you're nodding, right? So because I'm going to turn to you in a second about storage. So yeah. Sorry. continue Melanie. Sufficient green hydrogen.
00:17:45:14 - 00:18:00:00
Melanie Lienerth
Yeah. So we need sufficient green hydrogen. So what we really need to continue to do is build out our renewable energy capacity to have enough green hydrogen, which is needed.
00:18:00:00 - 00:18:11:09
Melanie Lienerth
If we can have the best technology, we can prove a hundred of times that it works, but we need the hydrogen fuel, and we also need the infrastructure at the airport.
00:18:11:09 - 00:18:18:20
Abigail Acton
And when we say clean hydrogen, of course we're talking about hydrogen that's derived from clean electricity, I think is what you mean.
00:18:18:22 - 00:18:20:02
Melanie Lienerth
Exactly.
00:18:20:04 - 00:18:44:14
Abigail Acton
Because we've been saying clean and green hydrogen. We need to clarify that. That means that it's drawing on electricity, which is clean and green. Fantastic. Thank you so much, Melanie Benedikt. Yeah. Good time for you know. Talking about the infrastructure that went we so that leads on very neatly to you. The EEUH2STARS project is demonstrating the efficacity of underground hydrogen storage in depleted porous natural gas reservoirs.
00:18:44:14 - 00:18:51:01
Abigail Acton
So Benedict. Why, and I think we've got a good lead in to that, was the work done by the project so important?
00:18:51:03 - 00:19:11:21
Benedikt Hasibar
Well, the nice thing about hydrogen is that the hydrogen is an energy carrier, which you can store in large volumes over a long durations of time, which we will need in a future renewable energy system. And actually, in summer months, already, renewable energy has to be curtailed.
00:19:11:21 - 00:19:52:12
Benedikt Hasibar
So shut off, instead of being stored for times where there's a huge need for energy. And this is where hydrogen can be a very important solution. And the storage of hydrogen, especially. What I'm really happy about is that we in our project EUH2STARS we not only show how important hydrogen storage is for the overall system, but we actually are operating our demonstrator plant, in Upper Austria, which is the world's first underground hydrogen storage in a depleted gas reservoir, which makes it quite unique and special.
00:19:52:14 - 00:20:00:24
Benedikt Hasibar
And yeah, it's very nice for me that we not only show PowerPoint presentations on how great this would work, but we're actually doing it.
00:20:01:02 - 00:20:12:12
Abigail Acton
Yeah. You actually have a proof of concept. There it is. Yeah. And I like all these world-first. Very good. Super. So what are the challenges of storing hydrogen in preexisting gas storage?
00:20:12:14 - 00:20:17:23
Benedikt Hasibar
Well, maybe first I can describe what this looks like.
00:20:17:23 - 00:20:18:18
Abigail Acton
Yeah. Please do.
00:20:18:18 - 00:20:35:01
Benedikt Hasibar
So it's not a tank. It's not a tank buried in the ground or a big cave or something like that. It's sandstone in 1000m depth, where a well is drilled into. So in the first place there was natural gas inside.
00:20:35:05 - 00:21:04:13
Benedikt Hasibar
So we already know that this storage reservoir is gas tight, so that gas doesn't go away. And now that the natural gas is withdrawn, we can use this geological formation to store hydrogen. That's been done for natural gas for quite some years now that you store natural gas in some amounts. And we've tried again in the winter, and we now show that it's also possible and feasible for hydrogen.
00:21:04:16 - 00:21:15:00
Abigail Acton
Okay. That's fantastic. So tell me how this works? I mean, do you pump the hydrogen in and then you pump it out again? Tell me a little bit about the to and fro and the infrastructure for that.
00:21:15:02 - 00:21:23:14
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes. Well, at the first place we need the hydrogen to come from somewhere, maybe imports, maybe electrolyses
00:21:23:16 - 00:21:43:15
Benedikt Hasibar
directly at the plant. And then we compress the hydrogen. So, yes, we pump it down, and to withdraw it, we just open the valve again, quite slowly and withdraw the hydrogen and this way we can shift the energy from times when there's lots of energy to times where we need the energy.
00:21:43:17 - 00:21:57:23
Abigail Acton
Right. So, perhaps we could even think of it as being the equivalent of water. You fill up the well and then you draw it off. Excellent. But there must have been some technical challenges involved. Can you tell us a little bit about some of the problems the project had to overcome, or is overcoming, because you're still ongoing as a project?
00:21:58:00 - 00:22:25:00
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes. Well, we are very confident on the technical side. So we've had much knowhow on this topic, and could deploy it here. What we are actually doing now is developing safety standards so that everyone knows how to do. We are also developing plans for bigger facilities, as this is a demonstrator with a capacity of 1 billion m³ of hydrogen, which is quite large.
00:22:25:00 - 00:22:41:23
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes, but we need larger facilities in the end. And we are developing blueprints for storage sites all across Europe. Which is the nice thing I think about this project is that it's not just for us. It's it's for the overall society.
00:22:41:23 - 00:22:43:15
Abigail Acton
You're spreading the joy.
00:22:43:17 - 00:22:44:21
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes.
00:22:44:23 - 00:22:48:07
Abigail Acton
Excellent. And are other areas showing interest?
00:22:48:07 - 00:22:51:18
Abigail Acton
I mean, do you have sites identified for other regions and places?
00:22:51:20 - 00:23:07:05
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes. So within our project, we're 11 partners from five countries in Europe. And in four of these countries we already have sites where an European hydrogen storage plant could be built.
00:23:07:08 - 00:23:09:20
Abigail Acton
Okay. You've identified locations which could work.
00:23:09:22 - 00:23:16:05
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes. That, and we also are doing the planning for the construction within this project.
00:23:16:08 - 00:23:31:05
Abigail Acton
That's fantastic. Super. Thank you very much. And again, like the other two wonderful guests we've had this morning, it's very practical, so that's excellent. It's not theoretical. You're actually up there making this more feasible as a part of the renewables mix. Excellent.
00:23:31:05 - 00:23:31:16
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes.
00:23:31:18 - 00:23:35:15
Abigail Acton
I was wondering... again I suppose it's a little it's a bit like the question I asked earlier.
00:23:35:16 - 00:23:50:17
Abigail Acton
I'm very curious to get a kind of an idea of what the future looks like. What do you think? When in five years, ten years time, do you think that we will be using hydrogen as part of the overall energy mix? What do you feel? More I mean, obviously more.
00:23:50:19 - 00:23:55:06
Benedikt Hasibar
Yes. Well, I think that's quite clear.
00:23:55:08 - 00:24:18:13
Benedikt Hasibar
Hydrogen is being used right now. And the gray hydrogen, so the not so green we are using that now, will be substituted by green hydrogen. And even more hydrogen will be used in sectors where electrification is not that easy to do. And hydrogen storage as part of the overall hydrogen infrastructure will be an important puzzle piece in the future energy system.
00:24:18:15 - 00:24:35:23
Abigail Acton
Absolutely. Otherwise, we don't have our wonderful new airplanes taking off and our wonderful new busses puttering around in the cities. Okay. Thank you so very much for your time. You've all explained the work that you've been doing very, very well, and it does make it feel much more tangible as a larger composite into the energy mix.
00:24:35:23 - 00:24:37:06
Abigail Acton
Thank you very much.
00:24:37:08 - 00:24:37:20
Benedikt Hasibar
Thank you.
00:24:38:00 - 00:24:38:23
Magali Senaux
Thank you very much.
00:24:39:04 - 00:24:40:01
Melanie Lienerth
Thank you.
00:24:40:03 - 00:24:47:05
Abigail Acton
You're welcome. It is a pleasure having you with me today. Goodbye.
00:24:47:07 - 00:25:10:24
Abigail Acton
If you've enjoyed this podcast, follow us on Spotify and Apple, and check out the homepage on the CORDIS website. Subscribe to make sure that the hottest research and EU funded science isn't passing you by. And if you're enjoying listening, why not spread the word? We've talked about the parasites that krill host, and what they can tell us about the biodiversity of our oceans and how to print a house.
00:25:11:01 - 00:25:32:18
Abigail Acton
In our last 52 episodes. There'll be something there to tweak your curiosity. Perhaps you want to know what other EU funded projects are doing to boost the uptake of hydrogen. The CORDIS website will give you an insight into the results of projects funded by Horizon 2020 and Horizon Europe that are working in this area. So, come and check out the research that's revealing what makes our world tick.
00:25:32:20 - 00:25:40:00
Abigail Acton
We're always happy to hear from you. Drop us a line editorial@cordis.europa.eu. Until next time.
Harnessing the full potential of hydrogen from green electricity sources
The EU is intending to have all sectors of the economy at net zero greenhouse gas production by 2050. But heavy industry and transport can be challenging to electrify directly. So renewable, and low-carbon hydrogen, and its derivatives, are key tools in the box. From less than 2 % of our consumption in 2022, by 2050, it is estimated that hydrogen will account for around 10 % of the EU’s energy needs. To get there, we need to create a stronger demand for the fuel, boost transport and storage networks and secure the renewable affordable electricity needed to generate cost-effective hydrogen. Our three projects today, all of which received support from the EU’s research and innovation funding, have some solutions. Magali Senaux(opens in new window), senior consultant and project manager at Environmental Resources Management Limited(opens in new window), is keen to see the day when the buses passing you by in the street no longer belch out fumes, instead, leaving nothing but a dribble of water. She helped to bring this closer while working on the JIVE 2 project. Melanie Lienerth(opens in new window) is passionately interested in hydrogen-powered flight which she brings closer at H2FLY(opens in new window), the company behind a test flight believed to be the first, forward flight of a vertical take-off and landing aircraft powered by liquid hydrogen. She explored the idea through the HEAVEN project. Benedikt Hasibar(opens in new window) is a project coordinator at Green Gas Technologies at RAG Austria AG(opens in new window) – Austria’s largest energy storage company. Benedikt is working on the development of effective and efficient hydrogen storage through the EUH2STARS project.
Happy to hear from you!
If you have any feedback, we’re always happy to hear from you! Send us any comments, questions or suggestions to: editorial@cordis.europa.eu.
Countries
Germany, Italy, United Kingdom